RAY IANNICELLI: FROM JOKER, DE NIRO & BILL MURRAY, HE'S SEEN IT ALL -- PART II

Ray Iannicelli is a man of many backgrounds. Born in 1942 Brooklyn, the Italian-American talent began his time in feature film in the mid-1980s. Only after serving 18 months in the United States Army and selling pianos for a short stint while he dipped his feet in the New York City theatre scene.

Though he started acting at age 30, and he didn't make his feature film debut until 1985, Iannicelli has racked up quite the impressive resume in film and television in the decades since.

Working with the likes of Robert De Niro in 2017's Wizard of Lies, Bill Murray in 2014's St. Vincent and Joaquin Phoenix in 2019's Joker, the 77-year-old has plenty of stories to share about his long career in the industry. Zach Catanzareti spoke with Iannicelli on May 22, 2020 to talk about his early days in New York, his rise to feature film and some of his more notable roles. Here is Part II of our conversation.

CLICK HERE for Part I

CLICK HERE to listen to the full interview on Soundcloud

Zach Catanzareti: Another movie was St. Vincent in 2014. Obviously, Bill Murray, one of the most popular actors in the world.

Ray Iannicelli: My experience was that Bill Murray is a force. Even though he has this bumbling demeanor about him. He's a big guy, too, physically. I didn't realize that. He looks like he could have played a linebacker in high school.

Really? Wow I would not have guessed that.

Yeah, he's a big guy [laughs], you wouldn't guess that. Again, for me, he was easy to work with. We did some improv, he was definitely the star. He's bigger than life. At least he was to me in that movie. You have to remember, this isn't a comment on their lives, it's a comment on the week I spent with them on a movie set in Brooklyn, in a bar.

And he came up with some ideas [saying], 'Oh, let's do it this way, that way.' He's a star and he controls his surroundings.

Was he someone whose work you watched beforehand and now seeing him -- I'm assuming that was the first time seeing him?

I'm not impressed with big names anymore. I worked with [Robert] De Niro, who I always wanted to work with. The only one I haven't worked with who I want to is [Al] Pacino. My impression with him was firstly, him physically. Big guy. Secondly, he controls his set. He gave the orders, and they were all good. All in good spirit and in a creative mindset.

You did mention Robert De Niro. You worked with him on Wizard of Lies in 2017. Robert, he's so big, especially New York movies.

He keeps to himself a lot. Again, this is just my experience, it was just one day I worked with him. So, I never met him until we were just about to rehearse the scene. [Director] Barry Levinson, he’s got a fantastic resume. He’s directed some incredible movies.

They said to go to set, the camera was on a track. I'm standing there talking to the director and from behind me, De Niro comes up. The director goes, 'Oh, this is Bob.' I turned to look at him and -- he's famous for being in character 100 percent of the time, which is not true.

I turned to him and said, 'Holy shit, you look just like him!' He looked just like Bernie Madoff. He looked at me and laughed. I took him out of his head a little bit. But he looked just like him.

Guys like him who maintain that status, they are very determined people. Very focused. That was fun, an easy day. 

He does seem like a quiet type of person. Even when I see interviews, he can be with Al Pacino, Joe Pesci and Martin Scorsese talking about something and he's always the quietest one.

He's the quietest one.

What did I want to say about Bill Murray? Oh, we went to an opening night party or wrap party for St. Vincent. I’m in the venue and having drinks. Bill comes over and says, 'Ray, come here, I want you to meet Weinstein.'

Weinstein must've been a producer on the movie. Unbeknownst to me and everyone, he would be in a lot of trouble a couple years later.

Was he nice to you? Weinstein?

He wasn't nice, he wasn't un-nice. He just shook my hand and went onto something else.

About one year later in 2018, you started shooting Joker. Man, that was a huge hit with fans, it grossed more than a billion dollars at that box office [...]

I think it was made for $60 million, I'm not sure.

Yeah, it was little. When it came to getting that role as one of the Haha's Clowns, how did that initially come to you? How did you hear about that?

Well, I had a manager who you spoke with. She got the audition for me with the casting director. That's how that happened. I got a call back to meet the director and audition to him, which I did. And I didn't get the role I auditioned for, I got the Haha's Clown. I auditioned for, I think an office manager or something.

I had a scene with Joaquin, but it was cut. But that's not unusual. It's funny, I've gotten a few roles without auditioned. I heard Joe Pesci never got a role through auditioning. I heard him say that. Raging Bull put him on top.

In this film, there were a few scenes you were shown in. You said one of them got cut. There were three or four scenes you were in, wearing the make-up and all that.

It's just part of the job. You go in, they make you up and that's it. It's just part of the job. Also, I did a lot of theatre and you're usually made-up more. It's much more costume-oriented with wings.

Obviously, Joaquin Phoenix put on a great performance, won for Best Actor. You talked about his presence, what was that feeling like seeing him?

Well, as I said, he was very committed to staying in-character. He didn't speak much to the other actors. And that's not saying anything bad about him, because he's doing his work. Hs' a very intense actor. He improv’s and he communicates well with the director. I mean, he'll come in and say, 'Good morning. How you doing?' [And I'd say], 'Good, how are you? Good.'

That's about it. He was in character. That was an intense role. He was prepared for it, man. He put his heart and soul into it.

And he was so skinny.

He was so skinny, oh my god. Oh my god. It was kind of scary he was so thin.

I think you said he didn't talk to you guys much, just coming in and coming out?

No, he didn't talk much to the other actors. Just small talk, a little bit. But in between takes, he was in character. He would speak only to the director. Other actors don't work that way, but he does, in this film anyway. Again, I give him kudos for such a wonderful performance. Obviously, he was doing the right thing [laughs]. 

Bryan Callen was in this scene, he's a real-world comedian. He spoke of Joaquin's demeanor and what place he was in.

He has spoken about that?

He did, yeah. In an interview, he talked about how deep he was.

Yeah. Like I said, unbelievably committed to the role and to doing well in the movie. I spoke with Callen, I didn't know who he was to be honest with you. I know he's a comedian and an actor. He didn't have the role Joaquin had so he was more accessible and joked around a bit.

I've always been an actor who went to do this job and then I came home. I didn't socialize much. Maybe because I had a kid and a wife. If I did a job out of town, I didn't even socialize that much. I don't like going to bars, I’m not a bar guy. I like to drink wine, but at home with a plate of spaghetti. It's sacred that way, anyways.

Did you have an idea of what this movie was going to be like? What the scene was going to be like or what Joaquin was going to look like? Was it a surprise when you first arrived on set?

It was a surprise seeing him. He was so thin. I didn't see him -- I don't think I saw him in his clown make-up, I believe it was just his street clothes. There was a scene that was cut where we had a gun in the locker room he talked about. He was a very impressive actor, man.

Did you get to hear his laugh? There was that one scene where he left the room.

I heard his laugh, yeah, I did hear his laugh [laughs]. That was something. Also, there was a thing he improv'ed. There is that timeclock and he knocks it off the wall. That was not in the script. He did that on his own. And he did it... it wasn't fixed. He busted up his fist a little bit.

He kept doing it because you have to re-shoot it. So, they put it back up, he did it again. I said to myself, 'He is going to break his fist, man.'

Did that keep you on his toes? He's doing all this improvisational stuff, he can do anything.

It keeps you on your toes, absolutely. Because he could come over to me and do something or to the actor next to me. Slap him in the head, I don't know. Yeah, it keeps you on your toes and it's good stuff.

And the director was wonderful. Todd Phillips, again, very easy to work with. Very nice, very direct, simple. Those Hangover movies are the funniest things I've ever seen. They're amazing.

Oh, they are incredible movies. Speaking of Todd, this ended up being a very different film for him. It had comedy in there, but it was a dramatic movie. How did he work with you guys?

He had a very light touch. That was my first impression of him. Very light, but he gets everything out of the actors he can. He'll come up to you, sit down, 'Hey, how are you doing? Why are you from? Your name is an Italian name. Oh wow, you're from Brooklyn? I'm from Brooklyn, too.'

He [has] a very calm presence. Very likeable guy. Obviously, very creative. That was nice working with him, I greatly appreciated him.

Being a native of New York yourself, seeing what Todd did to recreate the city from the early 1980s. What did you think of that overall mood he set?

I think the movie is going to be a classic. I think it's going to be one of the great movies of the last 25 years. Some people were upset with it, but it's a movie.

As far as setting the scene, yes, it was perfect. The 80s, man, they were tough for the city. Oh yeah. Crack and crime, seeing how politicians abandoned the city. It was a tough time.

One last question. Being a part of a film that big -- and you've done it before -- something that receives such high praise from professionals and fans, what does that feel like for you in terms of being fulfilled about the work you got to be a part of?

It's wonderful. You answered your question in your question. You feel fulfilled, you feel like you contributed to a piece of work and a piece of art. A small part of it but it's very satisfying.

Like Prizzi's Honor, it's a wonderful comedy. My first big-budget movie and I still am glad I was a part of that. I did a small film called 'Diane' which was a very low budget movie, won a lot of awards. There's just satisfaction, that you're doing something worthwhile.

Everyday life isn't like that. If you're an accountant, you go to work and it's fine. If you want to be an accountant, that's a wonderful thing. But people who are out of the business, they hold you in a certain scene because you're doing something creative. That's what we do.

Every once in a while, you work on a project that's recognized throughout the industry and throughout the world as a piece of art. It's nice to be a part of it.

I'm from Brooklyn, I grew up on the streets. My mother used to say that I was the only boy she knew who brought home a book from high school. I loved the streets, I got into some trouble as a kid. Who knew this was going to happen to me? It's an amazing kind of thing. I'm very fortunate. I made a living out of it, I still make a living out of it. It's a great thing.

RAY IANNICELLI: FROM JOKER, DE NIRO & BILL MURRAY, HE'S SEEN IT ALL -- PART I

Ray Iannicelli is a man of many backgrounds. Born in 1942 Brooklyn, the Italian-American talent began his time in feature film in the mid-1980s. Only after serving 18 months in the United States Army and selling pianos for a short stint while he dipped his feet in the New York City theatre scene.

Though he started acting at age 30, and he didn't make his feature film debut until 1985, Iannicelli has racked up quite the impressive resume in film and television in the decades since.

Working with the likes of Robert De Niro in 2017's Wizard of Lies, Bill Murray in 2014's St. Vincent and Joaquin Phoenix in 2019's Joker, the 77-year-old has plenty of stories to share about his long career in the industry. Zach Catanzareti spoke with Iannicelli on May 22, 2020 to talk about his early days in New York, his rise to feature film and some of his more notable roles. Here is Part I of our conversation.

CLICK HERE for Part II

CLICK HERE to listen to the full interview on Soundcloud

Zach Catanzareti: Starting from the beginning, you grew up in Brooklyn, NY. You were born in 1942. What was your childhood like? Did you have any siblings, what did your parents do?

Ray Iannicelli: Yeah, there were five kids. I had three sisters and a brother. Two of us are left -- my younger sister and myself. I grew up in the segment of Brooklyn called Bensonhurst, which used to be a lot of Italian Americans but it's mostly Asian now. I grew up in sort of a typical home at the time. My grandfather lived on the third floor of the small apartment, my aunt and uncle lived in the middle floor and we lived on the main floor. It was a busy house [laughs].

It's interesting because growing up then -- because I was born in the 40's -- the neighborhood was a very European culture. It wasn't a typical American culture. We ate different foods, we addressed people by their -- my neighbor was Mr. or Mrs. It was a whole different thing. Southern Italians, we ate a lot of fish, a lot of snails [laughs]. Not your typical American.

It was a nice childhood. I went to a Catholic school, my mother was a school teacher. She taught in a public school. My father was an office manager at the stock brokerage. He was the first of his family to be born here. His oldest siblings were born in Italy.

My mother was of Irish descent from upstate New York and she married my father very young and moved to Brooklyn. I consider myself biologically or by nature half Italian and half Irish. But by nurture, I'm probably 90 percent Italian.

Growing up during those times, throughout the 40's and into the 50's, film and television was going through a remarkable shift. It was being shown in living rooms more regularly, drive-in movies, more tv shows. Do you recall witnessing this time in history?

I wasn't in the industry yet, but times were certainly changing. Also, culturally. We weren't the first ones in our block to have a television and it was a big deal. We'd go watch the Lone Ranger on a black-and-white television the size of a computer screen.

It was changing. It was right after World War II, the culture was changing, people had a little more money. It was a different -- I didn't have anybody in the industry. I didn't have a cousin or uncle who was an actor or director, I was the first to go into the entertainment business.

I went into the Army after high school, came out and then I went to college. I started dating this woman who was my English teacher [laughs] and she introduced me to my first acting teacher. I started taking lessons. She was an actor/director/writer in the New York City theatre scene.

She played [John] Travolta's mother in Saturday Night Fever. She also was in Moonlight with Cher. She was a tough lady, a tough broad from Brooklyn. So, we got on pretty good.

So, I took lessons. She had classes, 10-15 students in each class. I started doing plays and that's where I started gaining my experience. In the village, I used to say that for 10 years, my career never got north of 14th Street. Sometimes, there would be eight people on stage and four people in the audience. But it was a great learning experience.

Things were a lot cheaper than, too. I had a one-bedroom apartment for $90. I could afford to bounce around a bit. That was a different time. It was easier for artists to make a living in the city.

Do you think you could have made it today?

I have no idea. I don’t know. You know young people, they live three or four in an apartment now. They share expenses, they share rent. But it's a much more expensive way of life.

I never had a second plan. I did a lot of different jobs. Mostly, I sold pianos. I never really had a back-up plan really. I just did it and took it as I came. I did a lot of plays. It was great training. If it gave you anything, it gave you confidence. That's about it.

You mentioned the Army. How many years were you on duty? I know you did electrical repairs.

Oh Jesus, how did you find that out? I went to school when I was in the Army outside of Baltimore and became an electrical system repairman on tank engines. So, working on the engines on tanks. Thank god we weren't in a war because I don't think I was a very good mechanic [laughs]. I guess if you have to learn real quick, you'll learn.

Altogether, I was active duty for 18 months. In the Army, I never left the country. I would do the Army bases around the country.

When you did come back, you became a piano salesman. It seems like an interesting job to have. Why did you get into that?

I got into the office -- I answered an ad in a newspaper. It was under the New York Times employment section. So, I went to the company and they were looking for help. Let me try selling, and I did. It worked out well, it was fun. That was on West 42nd Street.

I met a lot of people from different walks of life. Got to meet some girls, that was fun [laughs] some women. In fact, that's where I met my wife, she came in to buy a piano.

Oh really?

How do you like them apples? We're still together, I don't know how that happened. We haven't killed each other. Especially during this shutdown, the pandemic. My god. We've been fortunate enough to be able to travel, relatively a lot.

I'm just going down my IMDb as a reminder. I just did a couple stints on the Stephen Colbert Show that aren't listed. That was fun. I’m also in the process of shooting a second episode of a series we're trying to sell. We did one episode and finished the acting part yesterday. The second episode takes place all on Zoom because of the pandemic. I play the father, we're in the basement. We're all isolated.

Sandra James, who plays my wife, we've known each other for 25 years. She was in the Joker, she plays the woman who's on the TV talk show. Joaquin Phoenix comes out and kisses her, which was improvisational. That was not in the script. He's a wonderful actor, an incredible actor. Wow. He's in a zone man, when he is working, he is in a zone.

I'm going to ask about him. I have a few earlier roles I wanted to ask about. I wanted to start with Prizzi's Honor [1985], your first role.

That was my very first. I did student films, little films before that, but that was my first studio movie. Which a wonderful experience. Wonderful, oh my god. I was on set two weeks, had my own trailer. Things have changed [laughs].

Working for [director] John Huston, working with [Jack] Nicholson, who was very gracious. Very easy to talk to, interested in doing the work. And getting to work with John Huston, that was a thrill. I think I walked on water for about three months after that.

It was cool, I was so nervous. Oh my god.

What was your role like?

I was playing a wedding photographer, I was at the church during the wedding. I think I had a mustache then. It was a big scene, it took a while to shoot, a number of days. A lot of people involved, a lot of movement.

It was such a wonderful experience. As I said, working with Nicholson and Huston. I learned to relax on set, so on and so forth.

You said you got to speak with Jack?

I forget what we talked about. I mean, I didn't socialize with him. We didn't go out to dinner afterwards, didn't go over his house. But on set, because we had a scene. So, they yell cut and for five minutes you're sitting there and you talk.

He was very accessible and very kind to the extras. He would often ask 'How are you all doing?' Because there was like 100 extras in the church. He acknowledged them, which is a kind thing to do. Makes it a more interesting and productive working atmosphere, everyone is on the same page, nobody is better than anyone else.

Any time I’ve worked on a movie set and any of the bigger actors turned to us -- I've only done background work. But any time they turn to us and say, 'You guys are doing a great job', that is something you never forget.

No, absolutely. Being kind, being human. I didn't start acting -- I think my first lesson I was 30 years old. So, I didn’t start until late relatively speaking.

Through this times, the 90's and 2000s as you progressed, how were you balancing your roles with regular life? Did you have a day job outside of acting?

Yeah, I had a day job, sure. At first, I was selling pianos. Then, I couldn’t do that because I would accept a job out of town. Eventually, I had to let that go. Then, I did some jobs to maintain myself. I painted apartments, sold things at a flea market. It's funny because I used to buy these pots and pans in south Jersey, I would go to these flea markets twice a week. We would walk away from each market and I would have $300 in my pocket. That helped sustain me.

I did these odd jobs. You always have to have money coming in. My wife had a regular job, so that helps. Somehow, you work it out. I guess that's what happens today, you work it out.

As you got older and got more experience, did you feel there was a certain role you fit best? Comedic role, more dramatic, maybe more subtle performances.

I hadn't done that much comedy. I have a sense of humor about me, so I wish I could have done more comedy. But mostly it's been drama. It's just the way it goes. I'm not a major star, so I can't pick and choose. There are very few roles I've turned down, I just want to work so whatever comes by, comes by. You get into a rhythm and a mode, that's how the casting people see you.

As a matter of fact, I auditioned for a film six months ago, eight months. They asked me to improv, it was a comedy. I started and asked them, 'Should I keep going?' and he said, 'Yeah, yeah keep going.'

I finished it, they were happy with what I did. They didn't cast me, but they were happy. But the casting director said to me, "Ray! I didn't know you were so funny. I didn't know you could improv.' The guy has known me for 15-20 years. So, that's the way it is, you know.

Especially for the movies I've been in. Joker, I played a clown. But that's a dramatic movie. Did you see it?

Oh yeah, I have quite a few questions about Joker.

[Phoenix] is amazing right? Isn't he?

Incredible. But before I get to that, there were a few more that caught my eye. The first was from 1998, a movie called Rounders with Matt Damon and Edward Norton.

That's an old favorite now, they say. I was at one of the scenes and I sat next to John Malkovich. I think he was living in France at the time, he was talking about France a lot when we were off camera. He seemed to be a very nice guy, very introverted, very civil. Again, easy to work with. We started talking, did our scene.

He seems to be a very bright guy, too. I don't know if it's from the movies he's been in, he's always a bright guy.

CLICK HERE for Part II